Watch me and Roth’s review of the latest Dollhouse episodes “Getting Closer” the 3rd to the last episode of the series. We discuss the revealing answers and questions that happened in this twist filled episode. We also discuss the highly debated Topher and his role in place in the Dollhouse. Where do you come out on this debate and episode?
- Dennis
Best episode I've seen in some time. Loved it. Interesting theory about Topher – now I have to go and watch it again!
I watched the scene again and I guess I agree that it seemed that the actor was reading from a Topher script but maybe he wasn’t good enough to actually be Topher. Remember Victor as Topher? Totally 100% Topher. It seems like a strange directing choice for Joss to cast someone who couldn’t actually do a convincing Topher if we are supposed to get the hint. I missed it the first time around because Clyde 2.0 just seemed so bland. In fact, exactly like a bad imitation of a real person. Maybe because Clyde 2.0 is supposed to be an early version of the imprinting technology? Maybe Topher is a much more advanced version? As to the speculation that he knows – there is no doubt in my mind that Topher does not know. BTW: in addition to not reacting to the wipe technology, there was also the drug episode where actives reacted differently. Continuity error or all will be explained later? Maybe I need to watch the entire series over again now.
I agree, Victor's Topher was much more convincing, I just think he's just a better actor then the one the got for Clyde version 5.0
If you check out old episodes, The Attic and Epitaph One have certain hints toward Topher being an altered Clyde.
To me, if the writers and director are going to make that character talk just like him, there has to be a reason to it, they wouldn't just throw that in. If not, why not just make him a regular guy?
Thanks for watching, and let us know what you think if you watch any old episodes or after this coming Friday's which hopefully will reveal some new things.
Dennis
The only other thing I can think of is that it is the reverse – that perhaps they took elements of TOPHER and mixed it with the original Clude personality to create Clyde 2.0 – but that seems pretty convoluted..
Thanks!
Roth
Yeah that would be, plus wouldn't Topher know that his personality had been taken? He would have to sit in a chair and get his personality/memories taken out which they never have shown or alluded to.
Also, what purpose would it serve? The original Clyde was the one who created the original technology so he's plenty smart enough to continue working on improving the technology.
Dennis
We've seen names used as symbols of function before, 'Mellie' means honey, so I wonder if Topher Brink has a similar origin. Essentially, it would mean 'the edge of having Christ inside'.
What if Topher is an early imprint of Clyde before they figured out how to completely wipe a brain and before brain architecture? It would explain why the drug worked and why he wasn't effected by the shut down ray.
They did say he developed much of the hardware and I had the impression the architecture was his baby.
It could also explain the breakdown we saw in Epitaph One. Your inventions are going to cause the apocalypse, okay, your almost girlfriend was killed right in front of you, still functioning, what if you find out you are merely a botched re-purposed experiment and not a real person at all? Topher has always thought of himself as different, as better, as a real person.
I'm sure the ending will be much cooler than anything we've come up with, this was definitely thought out.
Too bad we won't see the impact of the cloning experiments from the lab episode in the show….
Yeah I was thinking the same thing about Topher and him being a different type of architecture because it was earlier on, and that's why he wasn't affected by the mind wipe. I guess we'll see soon what the deal is.
Dennis
Hey nomentionofkev,
Yep me and Dennis had talked about that. And yes it does explain the breakdown – I also thought perhaps Clyde 2.0 was some kind of mix between the original Clyde and Topher – we shall see this week! Cool info on the names – yeah and Rossum comes from this Czeck play that created the term Robot (Rossums Universal Robots( – BUT Robots were androids – humanoids who could think for themseves. served humans and eventually rebelled which led to an Apocalypse – so I think a Doll rebellion is what is being incited.
Thanks Again!
Roth
If you get a chance, you should read R.U.R. (Rossum's Universal Robots) by Karel Capek. Great play and you can see how this play written in 1920 has influenced a ton of Scifi. Seriously, a TON. BSG, Blade Runner….
The 'Robots' in the play were content to serve until their formula was changed to make them more irritable and allow them to hate which causes the downfall of humanity.
Just rewatched the drug episode "Echoes" – if Topher is a doll then Joss has got some splanin to do.
Before the big reveal, my best guess for Clyde 2.0 was Boyd. Just because from day 1, he didn't seem to belong at the dollhouse. His presence begged for an explanation and he clearly had an agenda. So if Joss laid the ground work for that from episode 1, why would he make mistakes in Topher's story? I'm laying my bet down now on the record that Topher isn't a doll.
If Joss has explaining about Topher being some sort of version of Clyde, then also has a lot of explaining to do if he isn't. That ending for "Geting Closer" is such an obvious hint to Topher being Clyde version ??? that if he isn't than there is no explanation for him to act like that (I can't buy that guy acts like that which is so similar to Topher but he isn't)
Dennis
Yeah – hmm well if he isn't then it was just a trick to through us off the scent – which kind of sucks. I mean he acted just like him…That was not unintentional. So it was either because Clyde 2.0 is some amalgamation of Topher (a real person) and Clyde (also real) or he is a Clyde. If not it was just a cheap trick…
Thanks for posting! Exited to see how it all shakes out
!
Roth
I’m desperate to hear the discussion of last night’s Dollhouse.
We shot the review last night – I believe he is going to post it up today. I don't think we were able to talk about everything we wanted to – but for me the one big plot change made everything fall apart. Which is really too bad!
What did you think?
Roth